IF faith schools are so good then they operate a form of selection that is as insidious as academic selection. I can only speak for CofE schools but their admission criteria are very strict. Apart from looked after children they only look at children from families who regularly attend CofE establishments. If they’re so good then it’s a bit harsh on children who live in catchment but who don’t attend church.
I think …Barry, I will play along this time. Yes ban them all…but because I am an atheist and therefore do not believe any children should be brought up in or be taught religion of any form. Those that wish to follow a faith should be free to do so when they are adult enough to make up their own minds as opposed to being in effect brainwashed into faith…
In this case we are talking about schools that are unregistered so the teaching content is pretty irrelevent (yet it’s mentioned)
…however, given the current climate, I dare say there are plenty who have been very quiet historically and never had an issue with Catholic or CoE schools, yet now seem keen to ban Islamic schools etc… groups and individuals that that will look to make a point without revealing their real hidden motives - bit like those bigotted cunts Br First…
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If you ban one you have to ban all regardless of whether one is open, accepting of people of all faiths and beliefs and the other is a stoneage horse in the sky lie, you have to be balanced and fair.
Why should religion be allowed a free reign in schools? This Country split from State and Church centuries ago, if you want to practice religion practice it in the relevant place, schools should be a mixture of their local population not in effect parallel lives from day one.
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I did not say faith was important or the reason these schools (generally) do well. I dont know why, other than what they tend to claim, but the fact remains. Some have slipped but conversely, it is particulatly true for primary schools I think i saw recently.
And as I said, the story you posted has very little to do with the merits or otherwise of faith schools, its about the much more sinister and dangerous unregistered schools appearing.
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But the wider issue is why do we need it in our education system? What purpose does it serve other than to divide along religious lines?
Baz keep up, you are letting your mini crusade blind you to the basics here. As I said, the other purpose they serve, mostly successfully, is to deliver good quality education.
Surely if they devoted more time to education as opposed to religious ventures then they would improve even more?
Am I blind to that?
THey’ll still be amazing schools even if they don’t teach religion anymore surely? Or would the religious studies teachers be going on a hunger strike for their rights to teach religious dogma to children?
Ok so you would like to improve them, not ban them. Sounds fair enough, good luck.
Religion is divisive and unproven, why have it in a school of learning? I am talking about being inclusive and open not restrictive, don’t you agree?
“To give pleasure to a single heart by a single act is better than a thousand heads bowing in prayer.”
Gandhi. Sandal wearer.
A true inspiration of a man.
You are doing a lot of talking but not too much listening.
I’ve got kids that have both gone through the Catholic system in Liverpool. Their mum is a Catholic, so it wasn’t that much of a stretch. I’ve got sympathy for both viewpoints; I don’t really think that religion should be guiding education, but I also recognise that the primary school my kids went to is the best in the city for SAT results, and that their secondary education has comprised a comprehensive religious studies component, which hasn’t only exposed them to other faiths, but also asks big questions on ethics.
The eldest got into a Russell Group University because of that education. The youngest got an A* Spanish GCSE at fourteen because her primary school thought it’d be a cool idea to teach the kids Spanish. It was.
The ideal would be to have that quality of education across the board, but I wonder how do-able it is. Whatever else you might say about religious schools, they have more to fall back on than regular state schools. They still get state money, but a lot of money gets donated through the collective enterprise of the school and church. In Liverpool’s case, it has resulted in the best primary school in the city serving some of its most deprived kids. That’s a brilliant state of affairs, and I’d hate to lose it.
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I thought Booker Avenue was the Cities best along with Belvedere?
Why should the state fund church schools?
Booker Avenue not in this top ten, or Belvedere.
That list also gives a good example of why the government funds church schools. 6/10 of the best performing SATS schools in Merseyside are “faith schools”.
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The other thing I would say is that some places have a regime that is good for the kid concerned. A mate of ours has a son who is a bit unruly. No harm in him, but very little in the way of filtering either. Loads of schools were unable to handle him, and for a long time, it looked like he might become another statistic. He has been going to King David’s for years now, a school focused on the education of Jewish children but also admitting kids from other faiths. It has completely turned him around.
I’m not saying that secular schools are going to have an identikit approach, but my suspicion is that he’d have been bounced off to some state-run institution for kids they can’t accommodate within the main stream. Again, it’s anecdotal, but the existence of a faith school might have done some good here.
I say all this as a person that isn’t particularly religious. The ideal would be top quality education with no religious dimension, but at the same time, the faith school system hasn’t turned either of my girls into religious zealots (or even religious, for that matter) and I’d wonder where the additonal funding currently raised through the school levy and the diocese would come from.
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What does value added mean on the scores?
From the article:-
Value added scores aim to measure how much better pupils do than might be expected, based on previous attainment and progress.
Well Lane Primary School in Tranmere had a value added score of 103.4 for its 2015 results, this means pupils are doing 3.4% better than the expected score of 100, one of the best value added scores in England.
So a school gets extra marks for doing better than expected? Sounds a pc extreme left crock of shite to me, I wondered why the usuals weren’t on there bar Liverpool college.
Have I read that right?
I’ve agreed with a lot of what you have said about religion in education, but this post highlights your downfall…silly comments about PC and lefty stuff whilst also having no idea about the thing that you’re judging (in this case value added)
Paps story about the boy who was turned around in the Jewish school may have been dealt with more successfully in the state sector if the funding for SEN was adequate. It’s not the religious aspect of that school that has made a difference, of that I’m sure. The success or not of religious schools is nothing to do with the religious aspect of them. It is to do with all the other things that make schools successful, such as funding, support, level of expectation (from school and home), quality of teaching and the full range of socio-economic factors. I’ve seen plenty of faith schools that are terrible and plenty of non faith schools that are great. And vice versa. The point is, the schools can be successful without religion and there is no need for religion to be in schools. In a moment of clarity, Barry has pointed out that there are places for people to go if they wish to do religious stuff, and school shouldn’t be that place. If parents want to teach their children about religion or their religious values then they should do it themselves.