:brexit: Brexit - The Ramifications

I have upvoted you for finally posting a clear POV, without patroniszing bullshit or just bullshit. although i take issue with your suggestion that YOU have been labelled shed load of stuff… the main themes around racism and intolernace has always bene that those with those views voted for Brexit, not taht all who voted Brexit hold those views… something somewhere got lost in the various heated exchanges.

However, you are wrong on at least one point above - In Scotland, the nationalist vote became very bitter and divisive and it also heightened the anti-English feeling - it was played up by the more extreme groups. I know because i lived through it and had direct experience of it. Its created long lasting and nasty divisions even within families and how is taht very good for a society? As democracy goes, I always thought it was designed to IMPROVE a society through establishing common ground and true majority opinion… not dividing 50;50 (48;52) - which leaves nearly half a nation disenfranchised. When that decision is compounded by such blatent inaccurate campaigning that fed on folks fears of immigrants, is it really any surprise that it causes such bitterness? Its not like a general election where we get pissed off and then on reflection we know we can change things in a few years… this however offers no such opportunity. Yes we have to live with it… and therein lies the problem.

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Oddly, this thread has started to remind me of an old Alas Smith and Jones sketch called ‘The Incredible Bullshitting Man’. Can’t think why…?

Well, I shouldn’t have to, but it was getting to the point where I needed to clarify, largely thanks to people making false claims. Perhaps people have forgotten the numerous times I’ve taken people to task for discrimination, here or elsewhere.

This is an issue that people have wanted a say on for a long time, mismanaged by successive governments. Cameron may have dictated the date, but Blair and his cabal largely set the timing. It was always going to blow it up. That it did during a Conservative government, when cuts are widespread and people are all too ready to blame the other, especially when the Tories actively encourage stories of benefit fraud or health tourism, while making promises to cut immigration to “tens of thousands” a year, implicitly saying “it is their fault, see”.

The EU is also to blame for the ill feeling toward it. It has pushed its projects far too quickly and with far too little consideration of how that affects member states. Anyone that has done any sort of experiment knows that you have to break new ground gradually. You try something, see if it works, leave it in if it’s effective, stop doing it if it isn’t. That’s not what the EU does. Wholesale change, all at once. Deal with it.

No British government has really managed to deal with it, so it should be little surprise that the public at large haven’t dealt with it either. The levels of immigration into this country over the past two decades have been unprecedented, and unevenly distributed. The vast majority of intra-EU immigrants end up in one of thirty Northern European urban centres. Some people, I suspect yourself included, probably don’t notice it at all. In other parts of the country, immigration is a dominant issue.

British attitudes surveys show that in thirty years, we’ve become a much more tolerant country. Only around 7%-10% people are genuinely racist, although around 20% of white people would still be perturbed if their kid brought a partner of different racial origin home. We are not there yet, both both those numbers were north of 50% in the 1970s. London is now (and I hate the term) a “majority minority” city, and very few give a fuck. We’ve come a long way, baby.

We haven’t suddenly become a bunch of racists, emboldened as a few hateful simpletons have been post poll. We have made the decision to leave the European Union, we need to start treating the people across the table as opponents and we need to contrive a way to make the best of it. Brexit under the right government would be an opportunity to rebuild the infrastructure we’ve allowed to atrophy so long, pursue an independent foreign policy which has some semblance of international law at the top of its agenda. As @cb-saint pointed out earlier, a vote to Remain was not a vote for the status quo, as @goatboy 's In The Army Now thread should illustrate perfectly.

You could (probably correctly) argue that once we indicated that we were leaving the EU, France decided it was staying etc etc, that the EU decided to go ahead with projects we would have vetoed. Like if your Mrs doesn’t like spicy food. Soon at the bitch dumps you, you can’t get on the phone to the pride of India for a curry quick enough.

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Pony.

I cannot verify this incident as I didn’t head to Liverpool when everyone else seemed to back then. My memory doesn’t recollect Pap telling me about this either. But I’ve forgotten a whole heck of things people have told me in late 90s/early 2000s/yesterday. I also was not present at the neighbour incident either. However, I do remember a time in a newsagent in Portswood where Paul had annoyed some lad and he went away and came back with a piece of wood. A lot of negotioation took place then to avoid an altercation.

As a pacifist* I do not condone people beating each other up over anything / having wars /gang stuff. The whole lot really. I believe in negotiation and the Corbyn way. In my job you need to be able to negotiate a lot and be calm and empathetic.

So this thread eh? Wow it could really really really put a lot of people off this site couldn’t it?

I voted remain. I am not a ‘remoaner’ (awful word) as Pap has so kindly said to me IRL. I get why those ‘bretixers’ (another ridiculous word) voted differently. Some will be for not great reasons, but they were their reasons, some people voted because they didn’t have the facts (that’s for both sides), some it’s a gut feeling, etc ad infinitum/nauseam.

This thread will keep going as long as we (you lot really) keep trying to get the upper hand on a very complex and unknown thing. It’s seems pretty pointless to me. We (you lot really) keep othering each other. I did a bit of that in the last two sentences. We are all going through whatever this is, we are all human, we should all try and remember this. A bit of empathy may help us all.

I additionally find Roy Chubby Brown pretty abhorent.

* yes I used to not be the paragon of this but hey we can change you know.

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Nice one @intiniki

It is becoming a comedy thread where everyone is baiting each other - mainly because there are no real arguments to change the opposing view - though Pap’s use of Vichy was funny at first but…oooops went into baiting mode there…Sorry :lou_eyes_to_sky:

Some people are better at baiting than others, have a bit more creativity and panache, who do people think is the best at it? Who is the master baiter of Sotonians?

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Who is the Master Baiter on Sotonians at the mo’?

Creativity? Panache? Bollocks. Who has a life to spend tine making a “name” for themselves on a site that’s the backwater of the backwater of footie forums?

I like it here btw

:lou_lol:

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That’s what i’m asking Cob, who puts the most effort in and is truly dedicated to master baiting their fellow sotonians the best?

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To be honest @gavstar it ain’t you or me.

We need to lower our sights perhaps? Metaphorically speaking of course …

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Image result for finbarr saunders

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I guess post Brexit w ewill have more Foreign imports? (this one is for @cobham-saint and @gavstar )

Image result for finbarr saunders

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I aspire to be a good baiter, for now I’ll have to settle with being an average baiter, sloppy and making a mess everywhere. But if I keep practising, work on being a good baiter, and one day, I might just reach the pinnacle of being a 'king master baiter.

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I thought you’d been to one of the Sotonian’’ after match beers?

Surely, if you had, you’d know that @saintbletch holds this title.

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Hmmm, think you might be mistaken there Bobbo, he taught me everything he knew about master baiting when we first met and I wasn’t too impressed. Maybe I missed something important, I was quite blinded by his shirt.

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Well, they do say master baiting does make you go blind. Well, that’s what my mate Wan King tells me…

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You know him too? You ever meet his brother Ewan Joy Wan King?

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Winding people up is one of the four things I’m good at.

I’d be disappointed if I wasn’t in the running.

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Are the other 3 things (in no particular order);

1/ getting the angle spot on at 50 degrees for the javelin in Daley Thompsons decathlon for the zx spectrum?

2/ switching things off and on again?

3/ knowing who rene auberjonois is?

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